Episode 174
Patricia Bathory on The Secret to Entrepreneurial Success: Mental Health and Relationships
In Episode 174 of The Business Development Podcast, Kelly Kennedy sits down with Patricia Bathory, a psychotherapist and entrepreneur, to explore the often overlooked but critical relationship between mental health and entrepreneurial success. Patricia shares her insights on the mental pressures that business owners face, from isolation and burnout to the challenge of maintaining personal relationships. The conversation delves into why vulnerability should be embraced, not feared, and how it can lead to more meaningful connections in both personal and professional life. Patricia emphasizes that success doesn’t have to come at the expense of mental well-being and offers practical strategies for entrepreneurs to thrive holistically.
Throughout the episode, Kelly and Patricia discuss the importance of self-awareness and establishing boundaries to protect mental health while still driving business growth. They talk about the transformative power of relationships, and Patricia provides real-world examples of how balancing mental health with business demands can lead to more sustainable and fulfilling success. For entrepreneurs and business leaders grappling with stress or seeking a healthier work-life balance, this episode provides valuable tools and actionable insights to navigate the entrepreneurial journey with resilience and purpose.
Takeaways:
1. Vulnerability is a strength, not a weakness, especially in leadership.
2. Mental health should be prioritized just as much as business growth.
3. Strong personal relationships are essential to long-term success.
4. Balancing business and personal well-being leads to sustainable success.
5. Entrepreneurs often face isolation and burnout if they neglect mental health.
6. Self-awareness helps in setting boundaries that protect mental well-being.
7. Embracing vulnerability fosters deeper, more meaningful connections.
8. Success shouldn’t come at the expense of personal relationships.
9. It's crucial to recognize when to ask for help in both business and life.
10. True success involves balancing business ambitions with mental health and personal fulfillment.
Links referenced in this episode:
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Transcript
Welcome to episode 174 of the Business Development podcast and today we're chatting with the entrepreneurs therapist, Patricia Bathory.
Kelly Kennedy:It is an absolutely incredible episode and you are not going to want to miss it.
Kelly Kennedy:Stick with us.
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Mark Cuban:Welcome to the Business Development podcast and now your expert host, Kelly Kennedy.
Kelly Kennedy:Hello.
Kelly Kennedy:Welcome to episode 174 of the Business Development podcast and my gosh, do we have an absolute rock star for you today.
Kelly Kennedy:Today we are bringing you Patricia Bathory, MBA, MacPCC.
Kelly Kennedy:Patricia is a dynamic entrepreneur and seasoned psychotherapist who has dedicated over a decade to understanding the intricacies of interpersonal dynamics.
Kelly Kennedy:As the author of building Relationships to achieve success and make a lasting impact, she expertly bridges the worlds of business and psychology.
Kelly Kennedy:Patricia's unique blend of experience as the founder and general manager of an import export business, combined with her practice as a psychotherapist equips her with unparalleled insights into the personal and professional challenges faced by today's leaders.
Kelly Kennedy:Educated in Canada, born in Brazil, and with strong ties to the United States, Patricia's diverse background enriches her approach to fostering meaningful relationships and achieving success.
Kelly Kennedy:Patricia's compelling speaking engagements captivate audiences with topics ranging from intellectual humility to the pursuit of existential purpose.
Kelly Kennedy:She advocates for the transformative power of relationships, believing that strong connections are the bedrock to lasting success.
Kelly Kennedy:With advanced training and psychoanalysis and family dynamics, Patricia emphasizes the importance of community and collaboration in both personal and professional realms.
Kelly Kennedy:As a beacon of wisdom in the fields of entrepreneurship and psychotherapy, Patricia Bathory inspires individuals to harness the power of relationships to create a profound and enduring impact.
Kelly Kennedy:Patricia, it's an absolute honor to have you on the show today.
Patricia Bathory:Oh, thank you.
Patricia Bathory:That was a beautiful intro.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, who is this?
Patricia Bathory:But I want to meet that person.
Kelly Kennedy:Well, let me just say after reading your book, it is well, well earned.
Kelly Kennedy:And you know, we chatted about this before the show, but I honestly can't believe that you were able to cram so much information on relationships into one book and, you know, as a huge advocate of relationships and a connection builder on the business development podcast, great, great work.
Patricia Bathory:Oh, thank you.
Patricia Bathory:Thank you.
Patricia Bathory:It makes me very happy that you took the time to read it and that you enjoyed it.
Patricia Bathory:That's definitely the best news I can possibly get.
Patricia Bathory:Today made my day.
Patricia Bathory:Made my day.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:You know, it's funny, I really, I have a little bit of a love hate relationship with amazing authors like yourself because honestly, I hate interviewing amazing authors without reading their books.
Kelly Kennedy:So I do try to read at least one of their books ahead of every interview.
Kelly Kennedy:But my gosh, I think I've probably read more in the last year than I've read in a really long time.
Patricia Bathory:That's, that's a good side effect of your work then.
Patricia Bathory:That's, you know, you cannot complain about that.
Kelly Kennedy:It kind of is, yeah, I'm getting crazy with lots of great insights, for sure.
Patricia Bathory:You know, that's, somebody asked me, like, how was it to write the book?
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, you know what?
Patricia Bathory:As, as tough as it was, one of the side effects, you know, one of the things that I had to do was read a lot.
Patricia Bathory:So I think while I was writing that book, I read 20 books as well.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, this is not a bad thing to do, you know, write a book.
Patricia Bathory:That means you have to read and research.
Patricia Bathory:So it kind of, it's not a bad, bad thing to have to do.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:And, you know, we talked about this before, but it's your very first book, and it is incredible, incredibly well written, well done.
Kelly Kennedy:And I want to spend some time on that because I know we have lots of entrepreneurs listening who aspire to write books and are maybe like, you have an amazing business background, but, you know, just never really took the step or never knew how to start.
Kelly Kennedy:So I think maybe some insights on that would be really cool.
Kelly Kennedy:But before we get into that today, you know, who is Patricia Bathory?
Kelly Kennedy:How did you end up on this journey?
Kelly Kennedy:You're, you are originally from Brazil?
Patricia Bathory:Yes, I am.
Patricia Bathory:I was born in Brazil.
Patricia Bathory:I actually come from a multicultural family.
Patricia Bathory:My dad's Brazilian, my mom's Slovakhe.
Patricia Bathory:How did they meet?
Patricia Bathory:That's a whole podcast in itself.
Patricia Bathory:So the two of them met in Brazil.
Patricia Bathory:We were born in Brazil.
Patricia Bathory:It's me and my brother and my sister.
Patricia Bathory:I lived there until I was 14 and then moved to Edmonton.
Patricia Bathory:Now why did you move to Edmonton?
Patricia Bathory:Well, my mom, who's Slovak, has a sister who immigrated to Edmonton, so that's how we ended up in Edmonton, lived there, went to high school, into Ainley.
Patricia Bathory:So I'm from your hometown.
Patricia Bathory:I'm excited to be talking to you, actually.
Patricia Bathory:So I went to Ainley.
Patricia Bathory:I went to the U of A.
Patricia Bathory:Got a bachelor of science from the U of A, and my MBA from the U of A, and ended up marrying a Brazilian.
Patricia Bathory:Right?
Patricia Bathory:Like, the world kind of goes around.
Patricia Bathory:I met a brazilian, very nice guy, you know, smooth, and I'm like, okay.
Patricia Bathory:Fell for him really hard.
Patricia Bathory:So that was 30 years ago.
Patricia Bathory:That's when we started dating and then moved back to Brazil.
Patricia Bathory:Married him, had two kids.
Patricia Bathory:Then we.
Patricia Bathory:You know, being the canadian lover that I am, I love this country.
Patricia Bathory:I love everything about Canada.
Patricia Bathory:I wanted my kids to have the sprinkle of Canadia on.
Patricia Bathory:On them.
Patricia Bathory:The.
Patricia Bathory:The culture, the values, the people.
Patricia Bathory:So pestered my husband until he agreed to move to Canada.
Patricia Bathory:So we've been back here for the last seven years.
Patricia Bathory:Now we're in Calgary, though I still cheer for the Oilers.
Patricia Bathory:So, you know, I have not.
Patricia Bathory:I have not, you know, in the playoffs, so it's all good.
Patricia Bathory:One yesterday.
Patricia Bathory:That's all a great thing.
Kelly Kennedy:Oh, man.
Kelly Kennedy:I was on the edge of my seat all night.
Patricia Bathory:What is that?
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, oh, my God.
Patricia Bathory:I'm gonna have a heart attack here.
Patricia Bathory:It's like, I wonder how the ER is.
Patricia Bathory:But anyway, so.
Patricia Bathory:So, yeah, so, been here, back for the last seven years, and loving every minute of it.
Patricia Bathory:Maybe not the winter so much, but, yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:Oh, man.
Kelly Kennedy:I was gonna say, I think there's probably a lot of Canadians who aspire to leave to Brazil.
Patricia Bathory:And people ask me, they're like, so what made you move to Canada?
Patricia Bathory:And, you know, I.
Patricia Bathory:Straight faced, I'm like, oh, the weather.
Patricia Bathory:And it's funny because people take a step back, and they're like, does she know?
Patricia Bathory:Right?
Patricia Bathory:Like, do we tell her?
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, no, I'm joking.
Patricia Bathory:You know, I'm like, no, people.
Patricia Bathory:And then when I tell people why I moved here, my love for Canada, my love for this country, for how progressive we are, for how our values, and the fact that we're so multicultural, so accepting of different cultures.
Patricia Bathory:And when I tell people this, I actually.
Patricia Bathory:I think I am one of those people who inspire Canadians to love their country because I love it so much.
Patricia Bathory:So it's.
Patricia Bathory:Yeah, I love to be here, and.
Kelly Kennedy:You know, we talked about this briefly before the show, but I think it's such a perspective that I've had from multiple guests on this show of how amazing Canada is as a country and it's like I'm, you know, I take it for granted, right?
Kelly Kennedy:I was born in Edmonton.
Kelly Kennedy:I grew up just outside of the city.
Kelly Kennedy:We now live back in the city.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, I have not ventured far from home.
Kelly Kennedy:And it's like, okay, yeah, we got these beautiful mountains, you know, 3 hours west.
Kelly Kennedy:We got, like you said, calgary, a very beautiful city, just not too far, you know, south as well.
Kelly Kennedy:But it's like, I don't know, we just take it for granted.
Kelly Kennedy:Totally, right?
Kelly Kennedy:You know, what is it about Canada compared to Brazil that, that really opened your eyes to this place?
Patricia Bathory:I think we end up falling once we live here, we end up falling into that rut of complaining about the cold.
Patricia Bathory:So it's really cold.
Patricia Bathory:It's really cold.
Patricia Bathory:It's really cold.
Patricia Bathory:It's like, yes, I agree, it is really cold.
Patricia Bathory:You know, speak to the lady that in December, I'm like, out of here.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, kids, send for yourselves.
Patricia Bathory:I'm out of here.
Patricia Bathory:And I do.
Patricia Bathory:I leave the country for a month or 2, December, January.
Patricia Bathory:I just find it difficult to be here.
Patricia Bathory:Aside from that, Canada is a country of opportunities.
Patricia Bathory:It accepts everyone.
Patricia Bathory:It accepts a different points of view.
Patricia Bathory:I find that we have evolved more than most when it comes to understanding that people have different points of view.
Patricia Bathory:Trying to listen to even our polarization is different from the polarization we see in the US and in other countries.
Patricia Bathory:For instance, I think we have.
Patricia Bathory:When I went to school, one of the things I learned, I remember Washington, you have to have your argument, but you also have to have the counter argument.
Patricia Bathory:And I remember that being fundamental in my growing up.
Patricia Bathory:And one of these canadian values that I find is, it's okay to have your argument, but you need to be able to see what the other side sees.
Patricia Bathory:I was part of debate for a while, and, you know, you didn't know until the debate minute which side you're going to debate, so you needed to prepare both sides.
Patricia Bathory:And I find that that is, is so rich.
Patricia Bathory:And, you know, I'm speaking about this experience in school, but I find that as a community, that's how we are.
Patricia Bathory:And maybe because of the influence of so much immigration and we are an immigrant society, I mean, you know, a lot of times, like, we'll sit around and I'll have one canadian friend who's like, maybe two generations canadian, and then the third's already gone.
Patricia Bathory:And they sit there and I'm like, they're a minority.
Patricia Bathory:And it's like, what about minorities?
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, no, you're a minority, like a Canadian born and raised, that you are minority, Kelly, not me.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, so, yeah, yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:And, you know, we talked a little bit about essentially the polarization and differentiation and, you know, I would say a good prime minister or a good leader, the goal should always be to unite the country.
Kelly Kennedy:Always.
Kelly Kennedy:Right.
Kelly Kennedy: they're going over, you know,: Kelly Kennedy:It's very hard to unite people, for instance, on the east coast and the west coast because they live completely different lives.
Kelly Kennedy:They grow up completely differently.
Kelly Kennedy:It's got to be really hard.
Kelly Kennedy:And I think one of the things that we really struggle with in entrepreneurship sometimes, or just as people, is how can we create connection with people that we maybe don't share the same understanding or values in?
Kelly Kennedy:And then it creates like a them versus us, even though that's not really true.
Patricia Bathory:The most dangerous four letter word, them.
Patricia Bathory:Because the minute it's them, it's unreachable.
Patricia Bathory:You can't get to them.
Patricia Bathory:It's just too far away.
Patricia Bathory:They're different.
Patricia Bathory:It's them.
Patricia Bathory:And I agree, that's one of the biggest challenges for leaders in companies.
Patricia Bathory:Of course, prime minister is just the leader of a bigger country, of a bigger company.
Kelly Kennedy:Yes.
Patricia Bathory:And I think I, you know, when I was looking at one of these stats, there's always going to be a part of people who will always be that polarized and they will disagree no matter what.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:So for those, it's not those people you speak to.
Patricia Bathory:Some people will always agree with you, and then those people you don't need to speak to again, because they're just your fans.
Patricia Bathory:It's the middle people that you need to cater to, the moderate, the ones that you need to convince, the ones that you need to explain what your ideas are about.
Patricia Bathory:And, you know, even if you disagree, this is my rationale, because if you're.
Patricia Bathory:Well, if you make decisions, I'm going to talk as a leader here for your business.
Patricia Bathory:If you're making decisions for the company to move forward, even if you don't agree, even if everybody doesn't agree, there needs to be a rationale why you're taking that decision.
Patricia Bathory:So explaining, making sure people understand what is the method behind the madness of your decisions, I find that that is very helpful.
Patricia Bathory:And of course, of course, as an employee, to understand that understanding doesn't mean agreeing, but understanding should open space for you to at least then become okay I'm on board because I understand why we're doing this.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, and I think the problem with business is that we live in a time where polarization, whether it be social issues, government issues, belief systems, whatever you want to put it, is starting to really interfere or cause businesses to have to make choices that, in my opinion, they shouldn't have to make.
Kelly Kennedy:Right?
Kelly Kennedy:Like, in my mind, most businesses are there to cater to other people.
Kelly Kennedy:Right?
Kelly Kennedy:Who are you to cater to one person over another person?
Kelly Kennedy:At the end of the day, isn't your business designed to provide value to the world?
Kelly Kennedy:I think we need to get back to that.
Kelly Kennedy:I think we need to get away from this polar polarization in business, whether that be a cultural issue, whether that be, you know, how you feel about your government, right?
Kelly Kennedy:Like, at the end of the day, business should be neutral.
Kelly Kennedy:And, you know, I try to advocate for that as much as possible.
Patricia Bathory:I hear what you're saying, but I don't know how successful we're going to be in that, because one thing that we see is, well, generation zed coming in and they are engaged as much as they are aligned with the values and the principles of the company.
Patricia Bathory:So what we find is that this new generation coming in, unless they are connected to your values, to leadership, to the purpose, unless there's a purpose that they're working towards and they're aligned in that, that's the only way they're going to engage.
Kelly Kennedy:Okay.
Kelly Kennedy:Okay.
Kelly Kennedy:I agree with you, though.
Kelly Kennedy:I think all companies should have purpose.
Kelly Kennedy:I'm just, I guess my, my challenge with that is, is that does the purpose really have to align with a political system or with, um, you know, a social charge of the moment?
Patricia Bathory:I, you know, I agree with.
Patricia Bathory:So two things.
Patricia Bathory:One is what I agree or disagree with, and the other is, what's the trend, right?
Patricia Bathory:So what I agree with is business is business.
Patricia Bathory:You want to buy a pen, you buy a pen from me or from you, it doesn't matter.
Patricia Bathory:It's a pen.
Patricia Bathory:And what you're saying is it should.
Patricia Bathory:That's how it should be.
Patricia Bathory:You need a pen, you go buy the best pen there is.
Kelly Kennedy:Sure.
Patricia Bathory:So I agree with that in a fundamental level.
Patricia Bathory:The thing is, we are the dinosaurs now, right?
Patricia Bathory:Like we're middle aged.
Patricia Bathory:Like I.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:Like we're.
Patricia Bathory:We're.
Patricia Bathory:We're not the ones who are really buying.
Patricia Bathory:Well, we still are because still the, the purchasing power is in our hands.
Patricia Bathory:But really, the generation coming in, they're like, okay, you're buying a pen.
Patricia Bathory:Oh, hang on.
Patricia Bathory:But you are nothing.
Patricia Bathory:You don't have diversity.
Patricia Bathory:A good diversity plan in your company, or you only will hire the whole white male sis, whatever.
Patricia Bathory:Like, that's all you hire.
Patricia Bathory:Then I'm not going to buy a pen from you.
Patricia Bathory:I'm going to buy a pen from someone else.
Patricia Bathory:Is that right or wrong?
Patricia Bathory:I don't know.
Patricia Bathory:But is that a trend?
Patricia Bathory:Absolutely.
Patricia Bathory:Absolutely.
Patricia Bathory:Because if you think about that, that is actually what has pushed people to get better.
Patricia Bathory:Right?
Patricia Bathory:Because if you're not better, like, we had a.
Patricia Bathory:I don't know.
Patricia Bathory:Well, you didn't read this because this is a very big brazilian news.
Patricia Bathory:Somebody's dog got shipped by mistake.
Patricia Bathory:So they were in Sao Paulo.
Patricia Bathory:They were gonna go west.
Patricia Bathory:By mistake.
Patricia Bathory:The dog get shipped northwest.
Patricia Bathory:So for three and a half hours, he's in the airport for a while.
Patricia Bathory:It's super hot, right?
Patricia Bathory:Hot and humid.
Patricia Bathory:Somebody gave him some water, but it was some water, not enough water.
Patricia Bathory:And then the dog gets shipped again.
Patricia Bathory:So it was a nine hour trip as opposed to two and a half hour trip.
Patricia Bathory:The dog dies.
Patricia Bathory:Of course.
Patricia Bathory:It's a huge thing about the airlines and, you know, and this whole making a big deal, that's what makes them become better, right?
Kelly Kennedy:Sure.
Patricia Bathory:So again, I agree with you.
Patricia Bathory:We should just sell pens, and we should not need to position ourselves for everything that we do or sell, especially our services.
Patricia Bathory:But ultimately, people buy into the idea, not just the product.
Patricia Bathory:And that is the trend.
Patricia Bathory:And so for us, I think it's.
Patricia Bathory:It's a matter of, okay, let's understand this trend, and even if not agreeing, understanding it, so that then we can position ourselves as good leaders to move forward.
Kelly Kennedy:Amazing.
Kelly Kennedy:So I want to spend some time on this just because I know there's lots of businesses are like, what do we do?
Kelly Kennedy:Right?
Kelly Kennedy:Like, how do we play this game that we, frankly, don't even understand?
Kelly Kennedy:Like, you know, like you said, we're middle aged people.
Kelly Kennedy:For the most part.
Kelly Kennedy:We're focused on.
Kelly Kennedy:On moving the needle.
Kelly Kennedy:We know we got families, we got other things that we're thinking about to try to think about the whole paradigm of everything else that's kind of influencing the day to day business can be very challenging.
Kelly Kennedy:What is your recommendation for businesses to do when it comes down to social issues or any type of alignments?
Patricia Bathory:So I think, again, if we want to be.
Patricia Bathory:So I'm going to think as an entrepreneur right now, as a successful business, what do I need to do?
Patricia Bathory:I need to hire talent, retain talent.
Patricia Bathory:So that's the number one issue people have today, is retaining talent.
Patricia Bathory:Because people like you and I, we will work for the money and we will work for the title.
Patricia Bathory:Simple as that.
Patricia Bathory:That's Gen X.
Patricia Bathory:That's millennials.
Patricia Bathory:So we'll do some of that.
Patricia Bathory:Now, Gen Y is like, I don't even care for the money that much.
Patricia Bathory:Like, I will make 25% less.
Patricia Bathory:That's a big pay cut.
Patricia Bathory:I don't know if I'd be willing to take a quarter pay cut, right?
Patricia Bathory:So they will take a pay cut because they want to work for a weekday, four day weeks.
Patricia Bathory:They want the company.
Patricia Bathory:They want to be proud of the company they work for.
Patricia Bathory:They want to be.
Patricia Bathory:They want the company they work for to be engaged with more important world problems or to be.
Patricia Bathory:To be politicized like that.
Patricia Bathory:To be, what do you call it?
Patricia Bathory:To have a stance on things which what you're saying is like, we shouldn't, shoulda, woulda, coulda.
Patricia Bathory:But really, this is what we're seeing.
Patricia Bathory:Now, you, as a business owner, you might not agree with that, but this is what the reality is.
Patricia Bathory:So if you, as a business owner, if you want to hire talent and retain talent, they will only come if you provide to them a clear purpose.
Patricia Bathory:If you provide to them that we are aligned with these higher values, that we do respect people as equals, right?
Patricia Bathory:That you have autonomy, that we will be meritocratic.
Patricia Bathory:So I think that's what it is.
Patricia Bathory:It's about, do you want to succeed or do you want to be right?
Patricia Bathory:Do you want to be right or do you want to be successful and happy?
Patricia Bathory:Right?
Patricia Bathory:Because right is, well, in my point of view, we shouldn't worry about all these things.
Patricia Bathory:It should be about selling pension.
Patricia Bathory:Your opinion is yours.
Patricia Bathory:You can be right because it is your opinion, entitled to it.
Patricia Bathory:But fact is, do you want to be happy and successful?
Patricia Bathory:Because if you do, you will need to adapt.
Kelly Kennedy:Well, I think it's funny because it doesn't really matter on what side you fall on.
Kelly Kennedy:At the end of the day, you're alienating customers.
Kelly Kennedy:How is that good business?
Kelly Kennedy:That's where I struggle with it.
Kelly Kennedy:Right?
Kelly Kennedy:I struggle with it from the standpoint of I want to do good in this world and I don't really care who I do good for.
Kelly Kennedy:At the end of the day, like you said, we're all human, we're all equals.
Kelly Kennedy:We all deserve the same benefits of life and business.
Kelly Kennedy:And so I do struggle with it from that standpoint of I don't want to alienate anybody because I think everybody deserves opportunity.
Kelly Kennedy:And it doesn't matter if you pick a side.
Kelly Kennedy:You are alienating.
Patricia Bathory:Absolutely.
Kelly Kennedy:You got to take your pick.
Patricia Bathory:What sides are we picking here?
Kelly Kennedy:I guess what I'm kind of suggesting here is that if you were to pick any side, if you're going to support maybe left leaning companies or you're going to support, right leading companies, it doesn't really matter what side you're on.
Kelly Kennedy:If you're going to be public about that as a company and say this is what we support, are you not alienating at least part of your customers?
Patricia Bathory:You know what?
Patricia Bathory:I absolutely agree and I don't think you should position yourself as nothing.
Patricia Bathory:Absolutely not.
Patricia Bathory:I think the positioning has to do with values and morals.
Patricia Bathory:So my company does not tolerate discrimination.
Patricia Bathory:So if you're left or right, if you come in, if you discriminate against whatever it is that you see in my company, that's a no.
Patricia Bathory:That.
Patricia Bathory:So it is about.
Patricia Bathory:It's not about left or right, but it's about elevated, elevated equal thinking.
Patricia Bathory:This canadian value that I speak about so much, it's about having these values or being a very small mind where you're discriminating where you are, you know, the bullying at work, the toxicity, that kind of stuff.
Patricia Bathory:So it doesn't mean who's doing it.
Patricia Bathory:So it's not left and right for sure.
Patricia Bathory:Like, I don't think publicly, publicly positioning yourself as a business is necessary or good.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:It doesn't matter who I'm voting for.
Patricia Bathory:I remember I used to teach this parenting after separation classes for Alberta.
Patricia Bathory:So if you get a divorce in Alberta before COVID it was mandatory that you go to these classes.
Patricia Bathory:Now remember, I'm talking about the importance of children, how to put children first and how conflict second.
Patricia Bathory:You know, don't hate your co parent more than you love your child kind of thing.
Patricia Bathory:And I remember there was one guy, he's like, who do you vote for?
Patricia Bathory:Who do you vote for?
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, that is absolutely relevant.
Patricia Bathory:He goes, no, it is relevant because depending who you vote for, that's how much I'm listening to you or not.
Patricia Bathory:So I'm sitting here going, wow, that's not the point.
Patricia Bathory:I'm telling you to love your child more than you love conflict.
Patricia Bathory:So that is the position I think we need to have what is right and what is wrong.
Patricia Bathory:Not if I'm voting this or that.
Patricia Bathory:It doesn't matter.
Kelly Kennedy:I know it's crazy.
Kelly Kennedy:It's crazy.
Kelly Kennedy:You know, even in Canada, you know, the level of polarization that has happened, you know, I would say in the last ten years, it's and I don't know whether that's just like the advent or of social media and the way that social media has really showed up in our world, right?
Kelly Kennedy:So we're seeing it all the time, but it's wild.
Kelly Kennedy:And I think we've really lost the art to agree to disagree.
Patricia Bathory:But you know what it is when you talk about social media?
Patricia Bathory:Kelly Aldouse this is the one gripe about social media that I have.
Patricia Bathory:Social media.
Patricia Bathory:I'm talking pretty much everything.
Patricia Bathory:If you look in your feed, the world is like you, right?
Patricia Bathory:Like, even if you are a completely off the wall outlier, your social feed is going to make you feel like your position is right.
Patricia Bathory:Like, everybody agrees with you, because what does AI do if you spend a lot of time looking at connected?
Patricia Bathory:My book, guess what's going to happen?
Patricia Bathory:It's going to be showing in your social feed.
Patricia Bathory:Stuff about Patricia and Patricia and all this.
Patricia Bathory:So I've said it's like, oh, man, Patricia might be trending.
Patricia Bathory:Patricia's like the most popular lady in the world.
Patricia Bathory:And it's like, no, I'm not.
Patricia Bathory:It's just because you like me, I end up showing up in your feet all the time.
Patricia Bathory:But if you don't like me, I'm not popping anywhere.
Patricia Bathory:If you don't agree with any of the stuff I'm saying, I'm never going to show up.
Patricia Bathory:So even music, if you like this certain music, it only shows you that social media only shows you the stuff you agree with.
Patricia Bathory:So you end up having a view of the world that is very limited.
Patricia Bathory:And I think that's what the danger is when we end up thinking that the world is limited to what we believe, to what we think, and to what we value, because we don't get access to the other side because the algorithm doesn't give it to us.
Patricia Bathory:And then we become dumber and unaware.
Patricia Bathory:And then when you go out in the street and somebody says, no, I think that as opposed to this, then you're shocked and you're horrified and you're like, you must be wrong.
Patricia Bathory:It's like, no, it's actually, half of the other world thinks that.
Patricia Bathory:So let's go get educated.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:So it's, it's actually an education problem at the end of the day.
Patricia Bathory:Ignorance.
Patricia Bathory:That's at the root of polarization.
Patricia Bathory:Ignorance is the root of discrimination.
Patricia Bathory:Ignorance, right?
Patricia Bathory:If you don't want to be polarized, I'll tell you this.
Patricia Bathory:Let's say you vote liberal or you vote conservative, and you're not even, like in the middle, you're like, more towards the right or the left.
Patricia Bathory:Start reading about the other side, because ultimately they're not all wrong.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:Like, there is something to be said about the values of the left, right?
Patricia Bathory:About this, everybody's equal.
Patricia Bathory:We should all accept.
Patricia Bathory:And it's great.
Patricia Bathory:And there is something to be said about the fiscal responsibility of the right.
Patricia Bathory:So really, where do you vote?
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, a little bit of each.
Patricia Bathory:Like, give me some of each.
Patricia Bathory:Because that's what it is for business people.
Patricia Bathory:Why are they.
Patricia Bathory:Why do business people tend to be more conservative?
Patricia Bathory:Because fiscal responsibility is a big value.
Kelly Kennedy:Yes.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:So it is simple as that.
Patricia Bathory:You can tell how somebody votes by really asking what they do.
Kelly Kennedy:Right?
Patricia Bathory:Are you.
Patricia Bathory:Oh, you're a business person.
Patricia Bathory:Okay, let me guess.
Patricia Bathory:Let me guess who you voted for.
Kelly Kennedy:Well, and especially in Canada, right?
Kelly Kennedy:Especially in Canada.
Kelly Kennedy:It is.
Kelly Kennedy:It is really hard.
Kelly Kennedy:It is really, really hard, because I agree with you completely.
Kelly Kennedy:I think 99.999% of people fit in the middle.
Kelly Kennedy:But the system, and it doesn't matter whether you're in us or Canada, the system is somewhat designed that the only parties that are going to win are hard one way or hard the other.
Kelly Kennedy:The moderate parties, they don't typically have a chance.
Kelly Kennedy:And it's really sad because it's like, I think most of the time, those are the parties that would win given the chance.
Patricia Bathory:But, you know, but again, let's go back to social media and news.
Patricia Bathory:What makes the news?
Patricia Bathory:A moderate approach like this conversation, Kelly, is not going to make it to headlines.
Patricia Bathory:You know what would if I started calling you this and that and throwing tomatoes at you and just being outraged and like, and say some crazy, you know, off the wall things to the left or to the right that'll make headlines.
Patricia Bathory:And that is going to pop everywhere.
Patricia Bathory:And then for extreme answer or extreme accusations or provocations, there are extreme answers.
Patricia Bathory:And then all of a sudden, here we go.
Patricia Bathory:That's what we see, right?
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Patricia Bathory:And like you said, most people would like to be more moderate.
Patricia Bathory:I think we are.
Patricia Bathory:Human beings are good.
Kelly Kennedy:Right?
Patricia Bathory:We're moderate people.
Patricia Bathory:If you get a one on one, you rarely get people attacking each other.
Patricia Bathory:Of course, there's a percentage of people that do.
Patricia Bathory:But that's a psychological problem.
Patricia Bathory:Most reasonable people.
Patricia Bathory:And there's something I really love, which is I heard once, it's reasonable people disagree about a reasonable amount of things, a reasonable amount of times.
Patricia Bathory:So knowing that for a fact, then all you have to do is go into these conversations with an open mind to try to understand what is it that they're saying so that you can come out of these conversations, if anything, instructed, not threatened.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:And it's like so much of that is based on values that you've grown up with or have been ingrained in you, or maybe you didn't even choose.
Kelly Kennedy:And I think that that's really interesting, because depending on where you grow up, you get values from your community.
Kelly Kennedy:And I think one of the challenges that we have is when something goes against those values, we just automatically shut down to listening to the other side and really having that open.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, I think it takes a lot of work, a hell of a lot more work, to have an open mind and allow a value that doesn't necessarily match with who you are inside to sit and spend some time to even lead to something else.
Kelly Kennedy:I don't know.
Kelly Kennedy:How do you do that?
Kelly Kennedy:Like, how do you do that on a regular basis?
Kelly Kennedy:Cause that's kind of, you know, that was a big part of your book, was talking about, how do you disagree in a healthy way.
Kelly Kennedy:But I think some of the challenge that we're facing is when we are feeling that.
Kelly Kennedy:That I don't agree with that there's an anxious feeling inside of us that shuts us down to being open to that other conversation.
Kelly Kennedy:How do we change that?
Patricia Bathory:I went to get a sticky because this is on my wall.
Patricia Bathory:Okay.
Patricia Bathory:This is from Alan Welles, and he talks about how much easier it is to have fixed opinions about things.
Patricia Bathory:He says, what we can't alter, we don't have to worry about.
Patricia Bathory:So the enlargement of necessity is a measure of economy in psychic housekeeping.
Patricia Bathory:So if you already have your opinions, this is bad, this is good, it's so economical, you don't have to think, right.
Patricia Bathory:I go in, you know, pink is good, blue is bad.
Patricia Bathory:It's simple as that.
Patricia Bathory:I come out.
Patricia Bathory:I don't have to question.
Patricia Bathory:It's a hard reality.
Patricia Bathory:It's difficult if somebody comes in and challenges that, and you have to think about that.
Patricia Bathory:And this is the one thing I love most about the therapeutic process.
Patricia Bathory:When I get my clients coming in and they're ready, whether because something happened or because they just have that need to enlarge what they see, and they need to start questioning these truths.
Patricia Bathory:And I think the truly enlightened person, the more elevated business person or human being, is the one that has less amounts of truth, right?
Patricia Bathory:Oh, I have my values.
Patricia Bathory:I have my truths.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, yes, but it doesn't mean you can't challenge them, because when you know better, you can do better.
Patricia Bathory:So why not constantly challenge, right?
Patricia Bathory:Like, things we're ignorant about, we tend to dislike or push away.
Patricia Bathory:But let's get educated on these things.
Patricia Bathory:What's your position?
Patricia Bathory:You know, some things I don't have a position on.
Patricia Bathory:How do you position yourself with the whole Middle east problem?
Patricia Bathory:I am ignorant.
Patricia Bathory:I am very sorry.
Patricia Bathory:I cannot position myself.
Patricia Bathory:Of course there's the feeling that you want them.
Patricia Bathory:Like, I want to say this, or I want to say that I will not.
Patricia Bathory:Because if you don't know, how can you position yourself?
Patricia Bathory:So unless you're going to seriously get into something and get that knowledge, and sometimes you will get that knowledge and you still are not able to position yourselves because there's something to be said.
Patricia Bathory:Again, I'm not going to polarize because to both sides there is something.
Patricia Bathory:So it is that ability.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:And I agree.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, no matter what the conflict, no matter what the challenge, both sides probably are right in one way or another and wrong in one way or another.
Patricia Bathory:Depends on the point of view, right?
Patricia Bathory:Every point of view is a view from a point.
Patricia Bathory:Every point of view is a view from a point.
Patricia Bathory:So, I mean, imagine, let's talk about our playoffs again.
Patricia Bathory:Can you imagine the hockey ref choosing not to use all the different perspectives from the cameras and just calling the goals from his point of view?
Patricia Bathory:From here, the puck went in.
Patricia Bathory:Well, guess what?
Patricia Bathory:From there, if you're actually there from that camera, the puck did not go in.
Patricia Bathory:It looked like it did, but it didn't.
Patricia Bathory:So getting what other people see, that's the way to get a better perspective on everything and just makes you wiser.
Patricia Bathory:It makes you richer in your opinions.
Patricia Bathory:It just makes you more educated.
Patricia Bathory:Really?
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah, it feels, and I know that there's a lot of people who would say it feels really hard to get that external perspective and receive it right.
Kelly Kennedy:And, you know, I mean, I'm going to say I've struggled with perspective because I believe that I was right on something because I was born.
Kelly Kennedy:I was born that way, or I was told that that is the way it is and the way that it should be from my parents or from trusted people.
Kelly Kennedy:And then later in life had to reflect on that.
Kelly Kennedy:And I remember that being a really hard thing.
Kelly Kennedy:And I did change a lot of my opinions after thinking about them, after meeting people, after having, like you said, discussion and essentially meeting people with a different opinion or a different way of life.
Kelly Kennedy:And I was like, you know what?
Kelly Kennedy:There's nothing wrong with that.
Kelly Kennedy:But at the time, I believed it was wrong until I had a chance to experience it.
Kelly Kennedy:So I think so much of it, like you said, is just ignorance.
Kelly Kennedy:We just don't know.
Kelly Kennedy:And if you spend more time getting to know a different perspective, I think you'll find that you do align more with it than you'd think.
Patricia Bathory:I.
Patricia Bathory:Kelly, you said something honestly, like you said something so powerful there, which is, I've changed my mind.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:You were able to say that what I thought then is not what I think now.
Patricia Bathory:And I think that's the number one fear of people, is to say, maybe I was wrong.
Patricia Bathory:You know what?
Patricia Bathory:Maybe when I thought that this issue meant that or when I thought this was a core value of mine, I I changed.
Patricia Bathory:I see that there are more important things.
Patricia Bathory:I see that there is a better way better way of doing things.
Patricia Bathory:The problem is, let's think of the profile.
Patricia Bathory:Let's profile leaders here.
Patricia Bathory:Leaders are always right.
Patricia Bathory:Leaders tend to be type a's.
Patricia Bathory:They are assertive.
Patricia Bathory:They are used to being right.
Patricia Bathory:They're leading for them to then be able to be in that position where I don't know.
Patricia Bathory:Oh, hang on, Kelly.
Patricia Bathory:So, you're.
Patricia Bathory:What you're saying then, is that.
Patricia Bathory:What I'm saying is not right.
Patricia Bathory:And you know what?
Patricia Bathory:I think you are right.
Patricia Bathory:And I was saying something that wasn't really jiving.
Patricia Bathory:So the ability, and I think that's a primordial quality, is to be able to say, you know what?
Patricia Bathory:I changed my mind.
Patricia Bathory:I've changed my mind because now I see things differently.
Patricia Bathory:And people a lot of times, feel threatened by it, and that's why they dig their heels and they sustain a position even sometimes when they're not even 100% with it.
Patricia Bathory:So it's about the winning.
Patricia Bathory:It's not about the position anymore.
Patricia Bathory:So, what are you fighting about in divorce, we see a lot of this.
Patricia Bathory:Like, what are you fighting about now?
Patricia Bathory:Right now?
Patricia Bathory:Now you're fighting about being right, because, really, I know you can see, like, I know you see how stupid this looks, but.
Kelly Kennedy:Oh, Boyden.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:I'm looking back at a younger Kelly who liked being right.
Kelly Kennedy:And I remember arguing for something that I knew was total bullshit, that was wrong, that I just wanted to win.
Kelly Kennedy:And thank God that Kelly is reconciled a long time ago.
Kelly Kennedy:But I totally get that.
Kelly Kennedy:I've been there.
Kelly Kennedy:I've argued for something that I knew I was wrong at.
Patricia Bathory:But, Kelly, just the fact that you say this in your podcast, like, that's big, that's humble, right, to say the younger Kelly.
Patricia Bathory:And I'll tell you this like the younger Patricia I eat yesterday, fought about something because we slip.
Patricia Bathory:It's not like I'm elevated now.
Patricia Bathory:I just know where I need to get better at.
Patricia Bathory:But I still sometimes fight to be right.
Patricia Bathory:And I'm like, what am I doing?
Patricia Bathory:What am I doing?
Patricia Bathory:And then you get that check, and then you change.
Patricia Bathory:It's okay.
Patricia Bathory:It's okay to be humble about our struggle to not need to be right, because it is.
Patricia Bathory:It's a personality trait is that, on the one hand, you need that confidence to succeed in business.
Patricia Bathory:Right?
Patricia Bathory:So being right and believing you're right, if you don't have that, you're never going to be a good business owner.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:Do you agree with that?
Kelly Kennedy:It's like, yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:Being confident to take the next step.
Patricia Bathory:And make a choice and believe that you're right.
Patricia Bathory:Because if you're not sure, I don't know if I'm going right.
Patricia Bathory:So I think leaders in general, business owners, entrepreneurs, leaders, I'm going to make a big statement.
Patricia Bathory:I think those people in general are confident, and they believe they're right.
Patricia Bathory:Great.
Patricia Bathory:On the one hand, that is great trait to have, because it allows you to move forward.
Patricia Bathory:It allows you to be self propelling because you believe you have the answers, you get going, you get moving.
Patricia Bathory:That's the one thing that is very good about that trait.
Patricia Bathory:However, there's the bad side of that trait, which is you tend to think you're always right.
Patricia Bathory:And that is the part we need to have in check, which is, am I always right, or should I question if I'm right also for your business?
Patricia Bathory:Because a lot of people fail in business because they always think they're right.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:You know, one of the things that I wasn't always good at, that I'm definitely getting better at now, is asking for help.
Kelly Kennedy:I, you know, thank God, through the show, I've met so many amazing people who are willing to help me, which is amazing.
Kelly Kennedy:And that's definitely changed my perspective on asking for help.
Kelly Kennedy:But.
Kelly Kennedy:But I think that as business owners, there's plenty we don't know.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, I've only ran my business for four years.
Kelly Kennedy:Um, so, like, I'm still a young entrepreneur in the grand scheme of things, and I have a lot that I don't know.
Kelly Kennedy:And I'm not afraid to say it, but I'm also not afraid to call somebody and say, hey, this is what's going on.
Kelly Kennedy:I'm not really sure what the right choice is here.
Kelly Kennedy:Can you help me?
Kelly Kennedy:And you would be surprised, like, if you're willing and brave enough to ask for help, how many people will help you?
Kelly Kennedy:And I will say right now, if you're brave enough to reach out to me and you have a business development question and.
Kelly Kennedy:And you need some help, I would be more than happy to help you.
Kelly Kennedy:Because I think that as entrepreneurs, I think there's a lot of businesses failing unnecessarily just because people are afraid to call and ask for help.
Patricia Bathory:Absolutely.
Patricia Bathory:And there's a lot of communities for that, too.
Patricia Bathory:Like, you have eo, right, the entrepreneurs organization.
Patricia Bathory:You have ypo.
Patricia Bathory:And the whole premise of these communities is peer help.
Patricia Bathory:So there's.
Patricia Bathory:And what I like about this is there is a movement now to normalize the need for others.
Patricia Bathory:There is a movement to normalize the need for mental health.
Patricia Bathory:There is a movement to normalize the.
Patricia Bathory:I'm suffering.
Patricia Bathory:Like I'm succeeding, yet I'm suffering.
Patricia Bathory:I'm struggling, whether in my marriage, whether with my children, whether with my friends, with loneliness, because on the outside, it looks like I have it all.
Patricia Bathory:And then really, there's all these issues, and now it's normalized to come for help.
Patricia Bathory:The amount of leaders and successful business people and doctors and just people that on the outside, you would never think it's like, all right, now they're all like, this is the human me.
Patricia Bathory:This is the humble me.
Patricia Bathory:And you've done that just now when you're like, the younger me would have said this, like, the younger me.
Patricia Bathory:So just being okay with being wrong or being fallible or having issues and questions and doubts, I think that is what's going to allow us to really now be successful and happy.
Patricia Bathory:Because before it was either or either you're really successful but miserable when you die by yourself, lonely, you know, having all these issues now, it's like, I think I see a lot more balanced people where you have that fulfilling personal life and also a very successful entrepreneurial life.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah, well, it's like, you know, you know, I'm a millennial.
Kelly Kennedy:I'm on the.
Kelly Kennedy:On the younger.
Patricia Bathory:I'm calling you middle aged.
Patricia Bathory:I think I'm going to have to apologize.
Patricia Bathory:You know, I got a young.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, sorry.
Patricia Bathory:I just put everybody.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, now that I'm middle aged, I'm like, I'm putting everybody in the middle age.
Kelly Kennedy:I would argue.
Kelly Kennedy:I feel middle aged.
Kelly Kennedy:So there you go.
Patricia Bathory:I'm young and I'm like, okay, we're gonna scratch all of that from the podcast.
Kelly Kennedy:Fit in well with 19 or 20 year olds anymore.
Patricia Bathory:You know what, Kelly?
Patricia Bathory:You're wise.
Patricia Bathory:It was your wisdom that got me thinking that you're middle aged, like me and the old lady in the young interview.
Patricia Bathory:Oh, my goodness.
Kelly Kennedy:I was going to say, though, even despite that, I grew up with toughness.
Kelly Kennedy:Being important, being very important.
Kelly Kennedy:Don't cry, be tough.
Kelly Kennedy:You know, don't ask for help.
Kelly Kennedy:Figure it out on your own.
Kelly Kennedy:Work hard, keep your head down, keep your nose clean, do a great job at everything.
Kelly Kennedy:And I feel like as, you know, as 35 year old Kelly now, I'm having to rework on that because I spent a lot of my life not being vulnerable, not being open to help, not asking for things that I needed.
Kelly Kennedy:Suffering in silence because that was the way you were supposed to do it.
Kelly Kennedy:And so, you know, I've definitely grown a lot over the last, you know, five years.
Kelly Kennedy:30, 30 to 35, for me, has been a massive, massive change in more ways than I can imagine.
Patricia Bathory:After 30, that's when you really start adulting.
Patricia Bathory:So it's.
Patricia Bathory:It's two things to what you said there.
Patricia Bathory:One is the evolution from 30 to 35.
Patricia Bathory:We see that a lot.
Patricia Bathory:And having grown with, you know, you have to be strong.
Patricia Bathory:You have to be tough.
Patricia Bathory:You have to do this.
Patricia Bathory:This is where you start questioning, are these things still true?
Patricia Bathory:Are these things still valuable?
Patricia Bathory:Do these things still make sense?
Patricia Bathory:So after 30, because until 30, you're not really questioning.
Patricia Bathory:You're like, you're going to university, getting a degree, you're starting your business, you're doing your thing, you're getting married, maybe having kids.
Patricia Bathory:Like, you're kind of not questioning because you don't have time for that.
Patricia Bathory:After 30, that's when you start questioning, are these my values?
Patricia Bathory:Are these not?
Patricia Bathory:Because after 30, they start being your values.
Patricia Bathory:They start being your thoughts, as opposed to things that were passed on to you.
Patricia Bathory:That's number one.
Patricia Bathory:Now, number two, and this is something I work with all my leaders, 100%, is we do a math here, which is when you're not vulnerable, you spend some of your energy to pretend you're okay.
Patricia Bathory:There's some energy expenditure in polishing this outside this strength that is fake.
Patricia Bathory:And that amount of energy is wasted because it could have been put to use to way better things, like putting your business forward or having better relationships.
Patricia Bathory:So the energy that we wasted pretending we're okay, pretending we're strong, it really is a stupid waste of energy.
Patricia Bathory:Now, being vulnerable, it's weak.
Patricia Bathory:It's.
Patricia Bathory:Well, I don't know if it's weak, really.
Patricia Bathory:It's the most effective way to spend your energy, because you're not wasting it.
Patricia Bathory:You can be who you are with your fears, with your vulnerabilities, with your whatever is not going well, and then you can take all that energy and invested in getting better and moving forward.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:And, you know, like, we talked about this a little bit before the show, but, like, entrepreneurship, too, can feel very isolating, very lonely.
Kelly Kennedy:Right?
Kelly Kennedy:Like, you know, you hear it.
Kelly Kennedy:You hear it a lot.
Kelly Kennedy:The view from the top can be quite lonely, and it really can.
Kelly Kennedy:And it's so funny, you know, one of my really close friends, super successful, runs, you know, a $20 million business.
Kelly Kennedy:And I called him yesterday, and I was just like, dude, I'm having an absolute shit day.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, I was just not having a good day.
Kelly Kennedy:I just.
Kelly Kennedy:I was like, I need to talk to somebody.
Kelly Kennedy:There's not a lot of people I can talk to you, so I just want to talk to you.
Kelly Kennedy:Here's what's going on for me.
Kelly Kennedy:He's like, kelly, thank God you called.
Kelly Kennedy:Here's what's happening to me.
Kelly Kennedy:And he's like, thank God we have this, because I can't talk to my partners about this.
Kelly Kennedy:I can't talk to my wife about this.
Kelly Kennedy:These are just things that I live with unless I have somebody to talk to.
Kelly Kennedy:And it's like.
Kelly Kennedy:It's so funny.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, I can't.
Kelly Kennedy:I'm sure every entrepreneur is struggling with that.
Patricia Bathory:Yeah, absolutely.
Patricia Bathory:Because the challenges of the entrepreneur is different than the challenge of the employee.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:Because the entrepreneur, they have to worry about their own.
Patricia Bathory:There's that responsibility of, this is my business.
Patricia Bathory:A lot of times, your own money is running that business.
Patricia Bathory:So it's really personal.
Patricia Bathory:It's not just the salary.
Patricia Bathory:It's like, all of my money is in this, especially if it's cash intensive.
Patricia Bathory:But not only that, there's that sense of responsibility for the families that you employ.
Patricia Bathory:So if the business goes bankrupt, it's my family plus all these other families that I employ.
Patricia Bathory:So there's this extra added weight.
Patricia Bathory:And then, of course, the, oh, my God, what if I fail?
Patricia Bathory:What are people going to think of me?
Patricia Bathory:What am I going to think of myself?
Patricia Bathory:A little bit of that identity that enmeshes with the business.
Patricia Bathory:If the business fails, does it mean I'm a failure?
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:So that's a big question.
Kelly Kennedy:And it's so funny because I've talked to multiple founders on this show who have lost one or two businesses that way, ended up coming back and becoming immensely successful, which blows my mind because I think of a loss like that.
Kelly Kennedy:And I just think PTSD stuff, like, how do you ever recover?
Kelly Kennedy:Because like you said, it's not just a loss of your organization, it's a piece of who you are.
Kelly Kennedy:You do not start a company and pour your heart and soul into it and not want with everything you have.
Patricia Bathory:For it to succeed and that.
Patricia Bathory:And for your own company, you'll do Saturdays, Sundays, all the different times.
Patricia Bathory:So really, like you said, it's your DNA.
Patricia Bathory:It has blood, sweat and tears.
Patricia Bathory:It's so enmeshed with your really, it's character defining.
Patricia Bathory:It becomes who you are.
Patricia Bathory:And then at what point the company starts, at what point the person starts this middle part that is kind of enmeshed.
Patricia Bathory:How do you make that differentiation?
Patricia Bathory:And that is particularly difficult when it fails, because is it the company?
Patricia Bathory:Does it mean I'm a nothing?
Patricia Bathory:You know, especially if it goes bankrupt or if it loses all sales.
Patricia Bathory:I'll talk about.
Patricia Bathory:I'll do the pitch for the chapter two in my book, which talks about this entrepreneur canadian.
Patricia Bathory:He's also.
Patricia Bathory:Well, he's my brother, so.
Patricia Bathory:We grew up in Edmonton, has a company here called patron Scan, which is id.
Patricia Bathory:It's a.
Patricia Bathory:It's an id scanning business.
Patricia Bathory:During COVID lost 85% of his business because it's all hospitality.
Patricia Bathory:Hotels were closed, bars were closed, restaurants are closed.
Patricia Bathory:Can you imagine?
Patricia Bathory:Like, what do you think happens when you lose 85% of your sales over?
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:You're not.
Kelly Kennedy:You're screwed, right?
Kelly Kennedy:Most of the time.
Patricia Bathory:So then he's like, okay, month.
Patricia Bathory:Like, it's gonna be a couple weeks, gonna be three weeks, and then month in.
Patricia Bathory:Like, people are returning all this because it's all.
Patricia Bathory:It's all.
Patricia Bathory:It's service based.
Patricia Bathory:And then all of a sudden it's like, what am I.
Patricia Bathory:This is going to go bankrupt.
Patricia Bathory:How long is this going to be?
Patricia Bathory:We can't, you know, there's all these families.
Patricia Bathory:I got to still pay salary, yet we have no money coming in.
Patricia Bathory:It does something to somebody's mind, right?
Patricia Bathory:Like, what do you.
Patricia Bathory:How do you pivot from that?
Patricia Bathory:If and then if you're not strong in the sense of if you cannot separate yourself from the business, you are unable to come back.
Patricia Bathory:So that's why it's so important to have that very.
Patricia Bathory:To have that clarity of where do you end and where does the business begin and where does the business failure just means business failure.
Patricia Bathory:Don't read into it, as in, it must mean then that I suck.
Patricia Bathory:I'm a bad business person.
Patricia Bathory:It means nothing.
Patricia Bathory:It just means the business failed.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:And I think that's really hard for a lot of people to separate because, you know, I find that, like, as an entrepreneur and as I'm trying to build both this podcast, my company, you know, my coaching, everything that we're doing to.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah, you put almost everything into it.
Kelly Kennedy:And I know that I can struggle with finding enjoyment outside of my work now because I think I focus so much on what we're doing next.
Kelly Kennedy:It's so exciting.
Kelly Kennedy:I love my work, and I can definitely struggle, for instance, to do things that I used to find enjoyable.
Kelly Kennedy:I struggle to do them now because there are times, especially with what we're doing, where it's like, that's a waste of time.
Kelly Kennedy:I need to be focusing on what's going to move the needle for my organization.
Kelly Kennedy:Right or wrong.
Kelly Kennedy:I have talked to so many entrepreneurs who struggle with the same thing.
Patricia Bathory:Yeah, I love it how you said right or wrong.
Patricia Bathory:Please elaborate on that.
Patricia Bathory:As a therapist, what do you mean wrong?
Patricia Bathory:What part of you thinks that could be wrong?
Kelly Kennedy:I think a part feels wrong because I want to enjoy my life today more.
Kelly Kennedy:But I also recognize that there's a sacrifice.
Kelly Kennedy:There's always a sacrifice.
Kelly Kennedy:Doesn't matter what it is you want to do.
Kelly Kennedy:You have to.
Kelly Kennedy:You have to sacrifice something to succeed somewhere else, usually.
Kelly Kennedy:And so it feels like, and I've talked to enough entrepreneurs to know that, and it sucks.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, this statistic kind of sucks.
Kelly Kennedy:Most of the ones that I've talked to you that are really successful have lost a great deal to achieve that success.
Kelly Kennedy:And even if they have balance in their life today, it took five to ten years of incredibly hard work to get to balance.
Kelly Kennedy:And so I think for me, I look at it as it's a necessary evil.
Kelly Kennedy:Even if it's not necessarily the goal that you would wish to have today.
Patricia Bathory:You have to be clear about what price you're willing to pay, I think because, yes, sacrifice is the price, but then you got to figure out, what are you sacrificing and if that price is worth paying.
Patricia Bathory:So, yeah, I will sacrifice free time.
Patricia Bathory:I will sacrifice like so to write the book that big of an endeavor.
Patricia Bathory:I needed to sacrifice my leisure reading because I only read things that pertained to that topic.
Patricia Bathory:I had to sacrifice.
Patricia Bathory:I love to work out.
Patricia Bathory:I have a pretty good workout regimen.
Patricia Bathory:I did sacrifice some of that.
Patricia Bathory:Like, I wasn't as steady as I'd want it to be.
Patricia Bathory:However, there are other prices I was not willing to pay.
Patricia Bathory:The book came out a year after I wanted it to come out a year.
Patricia Bathory:Like, that's twelve.
Patricia Bathory:That's a lot of time.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah, it is.
Patricia Bathory:And the reason for that is because I was not going to sacrifice trips with my husband.
Patricia Bathory:I was not.
Patricia Bathory:That's a non negotiable.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:I was not going to sacrifice having dinners with my kids.
Patricia Bathory:So I had a period.
Patricia Bathory: So between six and: Patricia Bathory: times came back to work, like: Patricia Bathory:Yeah, but the six to ten, sacred.
Patricia Bathory:Oh, but what it, no, it's not about ordering out.
Patricia Bathory:It's because cooking and being together and asking about your day, 4 hours, you need to sit down.
Patricia Bathory:So that was a non negotiable.
Patricia Bathory:So when you are navigating that sacrifice, I find that you have to have the clarity to establish what are your non negotiables and what are you willing to sacrifice.
Patricia Bathory:Because some things you are.
Patricia Bathory:So if you work out four times a week, you can work out two.
Patricia Bathory:But if you don't work out any, and if you gain 20 pounds, and if you don't go out with your wife and you ignore your friends, sure you're gonna have an awesome business, but you have nothing.
Patricia Bathory:In ten years, you're gonna have heart blood pressure, you're not working out, your wife might have left you or whatever.
Patricia Bathory:So I think more than the sacrifice is the clarity of where is this not going to cost me?
Patricia Bathory:Because you will reach success, Kelly.
Patricia Bathory:No matter.
Patricia Bathory:The difference is you might be super successful in five or ten.
Kelly Kennedy:I see, I see.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah, I think at times I can struggle with the pace at which things happen.
Kelly Kennedy:Right?
Kelly Kennedy:Because it's like, for me, I'm very results driven.
Kelly Kennedy:I want to see success.
Kelly Kennedy:I want to see the things moving forward.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, anybody who knows me knows that I'm very goal driven.
Kelly Kennedy:And I accomplish most of my goals.
Kelly Kennedy:I don't miss many of them.
Kelly Kennedy:But the problem is, is that I can get so set on that accomplishment that I can really block out a lot of other things.
Kelly Kennedy:And it's funny because I thought this was just me for a while.
Kelly Kennedy:And then I talked to a lot of entrepreneurs and they're like, yeah, like, that's me too.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, I have to, like, I have to check out.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, I have to do things.
Kelly Kennedy:I have to go hide my phone or lock it away.
Kelly Kennedy:I have to do all of these things in order to try to be more present in the moment.
Kelly Kennedy:Because, because I think most entrepreneurs, we don't live in the moment.
Kelly Kennedy:We live in tomorrow.
Patricia Bathory:The one, one thing I always talk about in therapy is your biggest quality is always your biggest quality is also your biggest shortcoming.
Patricia Bathory:So to be hyper focused, to be results driven, and listen, whatever I put establish as a goal, I usually get to it.
Patricia Bathory:That is a great quality to have.
Patricia Bathory:You get things done.
Patricia Bathory:You're accomplished.
Patricia Bathory:You go and you get it.
Patricia Bathory:The other side of that is it's dangerous because you will accomplish it no matter what.
Patricia Bathory:And that is what the danger is because you are so driven, you are so focused on that result that you, along the way, don't see what you're doing.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah, it's, it's funny because I just hate losing.
Kelly Kennedy:I've talked about it on this show so many times.
Kelly Kennedy:I hate losing.
Kelly Kennedy:I just do.
Kelly Kennedy:And I don't know why.
Kelly Kennedy:It's just a part of who I am.
Kelly Kennedy:I just, I hate losing.
Kelly Kennedy:I was born, you know, I think I played a lot of sports growing up.
Kelly Kennedy:I loved winning in sports.
Kelly Kennedy:I loved winning in everything that I put my mind to.
Kelly Kennedy:And it's really translated into business, which, like you said, has been very beneficial in business.
Kelly Kennedy:But it can be negative, too, because sometimes I don't know when to quit.
Patricia Bathory:And I'll just say, like, two more cents on that.
Patricia Bathory:I hate losing.
Patricia Bathory:The thing with business is that the loss is immediate.
Patricia Bathory:So sales this month were less than sales last month, or the sales this month were less than sales last month.
Patricia Bathory:So im going to work harder.
Patricia Bathory:And then, sure enough, next month the sales are better.
Patricia Bathory:So the thermometer is very quick.
Patricia Bathory:So your win and your wins and the losses are immediate.
Patricia Bathory:The problem with losing your health, losing your mental health, losing your wife and losing your children is that it's not overnight.
Patricia Bathory:Like, you cannot adjust it over months when you realize you might have won three years in a row business wise, but in three years, you've been slowly losing these relationships.
Patricia Bathory:You have been slowly losing these intangibles that are so worthy, but they are not measurable.
Patricia Bathory:And then when you notice you can't go back the three years and you cannot revert overnight.
Kelly Kennedy:It's not an overnight.
Patricia Bathory:It's not.
Patricia Bathory:So it's like, okay, oh, my God.
Patricia Bathory:My wife is perfect example.
Patricia Bathory:My wife said she's leaving me.
Patricia Bathory:Like, I don't know what happened or like, my son will not speak to me, and you're sitting there, okay, where did this start?
Patricia Bathory:I don't know.
Patricia Bathory:Just overnight.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, let's go back to the year they were born.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:So it's like relationships are built.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Patricia Bathory:And they're earned.
Patricia Bathory:They're not.
Patricia Bathory:You're not entitled to good relationships.
Patricia Bathory:They're built or they're earned.
Patricia Bathory:So if you don't work at them, if you don't make them, you're known, non negotiable.
Patricia Bathory:Then you will lose them over time, no matter how successful you are in business, and you won't see it coming.
Patricia Bathory:So I think, you know, you being such a young at 35, these are wisdom words from an old lady that, you know, it is.
Patricia Bathory:It's something you build over time.
Patricia Bathory:So I think, again, going back to the.
Patricia Bathory:Establishing the non negotiables so that you can continue to achieve again, I don't want you to get rid of that great quality you have, which is a go getter.
Patricia Bathory:You put the goals and for sure you're going to achieve them.
Patricia Bathory:Keep that, but not to the point where it becomes mania and you lose stuff that is very important to you.
Kelly Kennedy:I think one of the challenges that I have, Patricia, is that I believe deeply in momentum, and I believe that you have momentum when you have it, and you have to take advantage of it when you have it.
Kelly Kennedy:And I think I have a bit of a fear that if I take a step back, I'm going to lose that momentum and I'll regret doing it.
Patricia Bathory:But why are you stepping back?
Kelly Kennedy:Well, I don't know.
Kelly Kennedy: time, like, I'm getting up at: Kelly Kennedy: get done if I don't get up at: Kelly Kennedy:i'm not.
Kelly Kennedy:It was funny is I'm not a morning person.
Kelly Kennedy:I became a morning person as an entrepreneur to get more time because I couldn't rob time anymore from the evenings and weekends, so I had to rob it from my sleep in the morning.
Patricia Bathory:I'm going to get you, but it's funny.
Patricia Bathory:Get you to read that book while we sleep.
Kelly Kennedy:It's like, yeah, it's so funny.
Kelly Kennedy:I've become a morning person, more so out of necessity than desire.
Kelly Kennedy:But now.
Kelly Kennedy:Now I actually love it.
Kelly Kennedy:I love morning time.
Kelly Kennedy:I never did, but I became a morning person.
Kelly Kennedy:But it wasn't really a choice that I would have made without needing that time, which is super funny.
Patricia Bathory:That is really funny.
Patricia Bathory:That is.
Patricia Bathory:It's, you know, you do what you need to do, for sure.
Patricia Bathory:And it is about.
Patricia Bathory:It's just not binary, as in, I'm gonna full throttle this or I'm gonna step on the sideline.
Patricia Bathory:It's just.
Patricia Bathory:It's not this or that.
Patricia Bathory:It's not.
Patricia Bathory:I'm a momentum person, or I let it go.
Patricia Bathory:It's not about letting it go.
Patricia Bathory:It is about, though, doing enough, keeping in check that you are a machine and you are.
Patricia Bathory:You have limited resources.
Patricia Bathory:The body is a machine, and if you don't respect it, it won't respect you back.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:And the same with your relationships.
Patricia Bathory:If you don't respect them, they won't respect your back.
Patricia Bathory:So it is also about.
Patricia Bathory:It's all the things you want to build parallel to each other.
Patricia Bathory:So momentum in that as well.
Kelly Kennedy:One of the things that you said that really resonated with me is you'll be successful either way.
Kelly Kennedy:It just might take another year.
Kelly Kennedy:And I think, like, I.
Kelly Kennedy:I've struggled with thinking that because I think, well, that's a year that I could have been more successful.
Kelly Kennedy:As stupid as that is.
Kelly Kennedy:That's what goes on in my head.
Kelly Kennedy:It's not that.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, it's like.
Kelly Kennedy:It's like, yeah, but I could be there or I could be here, right?
Kelly Kennedy:Like, it just.
Kelly Kennedy:And I think that is just like.
Kelly Kennedy:And I have so many friends who would have say the same thing.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, if I was to really pin them down and have that conversation, they would be like, I hear, yeah, but if you slow down, you're slowing down.
Kelly Kennedy:And why?
Kelly Kennedy:When you could.
Kelly Kennedy:But you're right.
Kelly Kennedy:It's like, the whole goal, and this is the part that I struggle with is the whole goal of success for me is freedom.
Kelly Kennedy:And yet I'm less free today than I have ever been in my entire life.
Patricia Bathory:Boom.
Patricia Bathory:I have nothing to say to that.
Patricia Bathory:But can we say it again so we can highlight it?
Kelly Kennedy:Oh, we'll highlight it.
Kelly Kennedy:Boom.
Patricia Bathory:Like, I.
Patricia Bathory:Yeah, I don't think I can ever say anything that comes after that.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah, it's.
Kelly Kennedy:It is weird.
Kelly Kennedy:It's a weird paradigm.
Kelly Kennedy:But I think in my world, you know, and to a lot of people that I've chatted with who are successful and now have freedom, they had to work very hard to get there, and now they have it, and it's amazing.
Kelly Kennedy:And it's like, I think there's a part of me being young and striving and wanting to get.
Kelly Kennedy:There's like, I want to do that by 40.
Kelly Kennedy:I want to earn my freedom then so that I can have more of that time.
Kelly Kennedy:But, yeah, it does feel like a shitty trade.
Kelly Kennedy:It does feel like I'm losing today.
Kelly Kennedy:And the shitty part about that is, is tomorrow's not a guarantee and 40.
Patricia Bathory:You'Re going to want more because it's a drug.
Patricia Bathory:Right?
Patricia Bathory:Achieving is a drug.
Patricia Bathory:So every time you achieve something, you want something more.
Patricia Bathory:So it's almost like you need to get cured from that obsession.
Patricia Bathory:Because I'll tell you something, I remember financial independence was probably my number one core value.
Patricia Bathory:Like it is nuts to say.
Patricia Bathory:And, you know, I have reformed since.
Patricia Bathory:But I guess, like my brother says, yeah, you've reformed because you've achieved it.
Patricia Bathory:So, yeah, I guess, but.
Patricia Bathory:Right, and then how much do I need?
Patricia Bathory:And then to me it's like, okay, you need to have this much and then you reach it.
Patricia Bathory:And then it's like, okay, then I need to have this much and then you reach it today.
Patricia Bathory:Like, I kid you not, I have many times as much as I first determined I wanted to have.
Patricia Bathory:It's sitting there like comfortable, right?
Patricia Bathory:And the other day I was doing my taxes and I'm like, okay, how much money do I have and all this?
Patricia Bathory:And I'm like, why do I still run for it?
Patricia Bathory:Why do I still want to do more and more and achieve more and more?
Patricia Bathory:Because it is a drug.
Patricia Bathory:So it's okay to have that.
Patricia Bathory:You know, I don't think it's a bad thing to have ambition to run for things, but I think it needs to be from a place of how can I contribute more?
Patricia Bathory:How is my business going to solve more people's problems?
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:How is.
Patricia Bathory:Because money will come no matter what.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:And how can you serve your community and do all this coaching and help people become more successful in their businesses and have this great podcast that people are listening and hopefully will make their day better.
Patricia Bathory:How can you do this that is service to your community, still make some money on the side, but not give up your non negotiables.
Patricia Bathory:I would love for your marriage to be forever.
Patricia Bathory:I would love for you, if you have kids or if you're going to have them, for you to have a great relationship with them.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:I have three stepsons and I have a almost six month old biological son.
Kelly Kennedy:And I look at him now and I just think, like, I want to spend as much time as humanly possible with that, with those boys, you know?
Kelly Kennedy:And it does feel like, okay, like, okay, what that means if I want to spend more time with them, I need to really work hard to make it today so that I can have that time with them later.
Kelly Kennedy:But, yeah, it's like, I think we're all struggling with where do we make that sacrifice.
Kelly Kennedy:And I know I struggle with it immensely and, you know, I, my relationships have suffered, you know, my friendships have suffered a lot of things.
Kelly Kennedy:My health has suffered a lot of things have suffered.
Patricia Bathory:Funny how I pointed them all out.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, did I point them all out for you?
Patricia Bathory:And we, dear listener, we did not talk about this before.
Kelly Kennedy:No, we did not.
Kelly Kennedy:No.
Kelly Kennedy:But it's, but I would argue almost anybody I know who is ambitious has suffered from all the same things.
Kelly Kennedy:And my God, is it just the price we all pay?
Kelly Kennedy:Why do we, why is it that we're on this hamster wheel?
Patricia Bathory:I propose to you, Kelly, not to be binary, yes or no?
Patricia Bathory:So it's not either I succeed and I follow this momentum and I get going, or I let go of this dream, and then I'm not going to be successful and I just forget and I'm going to be mediocre.
Patricia Bathory:What I'm proposing is this, and success and a good relationship.
Patricia Bathory:Success and great relationships with your children.
Patricia Bathory:Success and great health and working out and being in shape and not gaining a bunch of weight and eating healthy, because it is not binary.
Patricia Bathory:And I think this is what our generation now is realizing, is that you actually can have it all.
Patricia Bathory:You can have health and success.
Patricia Bathory:It's just you need to have success realizing that that has both sides.
Patricia Bathory:The really great part, which is the drive, but also needs to be kept in check.
Patricia Bathory:So you take your calendar.
Patricia Bathory:If this was a therapy session, I'd be like, let's open that calendar.
Patricia Bathory:And I would make sure that we put in there, like, the blocks of time with wife and children.
Patricia Bathory:I would put in there the blocks of workout times, and those would be in a color that are non negotiable.
Patricia Bathory:Oh, but I have a really important meeting.
Patricia Bathory:Well, then you change the time of your working out.
Patricia Bathory:What are you going to get out of that?
Patricia Bathory:You know, you can, you can move it around, but it has to be on that day or that week.
Patricia Bathory:So you track, yeah, I'm going to work out four times a week.
Patricia Bathory:Well, I don't care if you have to do it Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, but it needs to be done.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Patricia Bathory:So, yeah, because then you can have it all.
Patricia Bathory:You can have it all.
Patricia Bathory:That's, that's what my whole, like, I want to convert everybody to believe it.
Patricia Bathory:You can.
Patricia Bathory:It's not binary.
Patricia Bathory:It's not.
Patricia Bathory:Either you're successful or you're like a deadbeat under the bridge.
Patricia Bathory:It's like, no, there's, you can have it all.
Kelly Kennedy:I was going to say, patricia, this is starting to feel a little bit like a therapy session.
Patricia Bathory:Well, there we go.
Patricia Bathory:I'll get, I'll get you booked for next one.
Kelly Kennedy:Oh, my goodness.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah, no, and I want to spend a little bit of time on that because I think that your kind of career jump, you know, you were a successful, and still are not just were, still are a successful entrepreneur who decided to then pursue a path in therapy.
Kelly Kennedy:How like, that seems like a very interesting jump.
Kelly Kennedy:You were already incredibly successful, and yet you just, you went the therapy route.
Kelly Kennedy:Why did you do that?
Patricia Bathory:Because remember where I was telling you about, you know, you're successful in something, and then all of a sudden you want meaning.
Patricia Bathory:I love, I have an import export business.
Patricia Bathory:I still run it.
Patricia Bathory:It's 20.
Patricia Bathory:How old is it now?
Patricia Bathory:23 years old.
Kelly Kennedy:I got 23 years on my.
Patricia Bathory:23 years old.
Patricia Bathory:I sell food to private labels in the US.
Patricia Bathory:Love the business.
Patricia Bathory:Super profitable.
Patricia Bathory:Does it well.
Patricia Bathory:So the whole idea was, how can I contribute more?
Patricia Bathory:And this is what I was telling about while you're coaching about your podcast, how do you contribute to this big world?
Patricia Bathory:How do you help people live better lives?
Patricia Bathory:And of course, the pivot was, I started going to therapy.
Patricia Bathory:I saw the effect that the therapist had in my life, and I was like, man, I want to have this impact in somebody else's life because that is meaning.
Patricia Bathory:That is a life where you die.
Patricia Bathory:You're like, I've helped people.
Patricia Bathory:I wasn't just self serving all life long.
Patricia Bathory:So that's what I did.
Patricia Bathory:Went back to school, so I got a master's in psychology, started working, started seeing clients.
Patricia Bathory:I have a psychoanalytical training in Brazil as well.
Patricia Bathory:And I love it.
Patricia Bathory:This is the truly my passion work.
Patricia Bathory:Love talking to people.
Patricia Bathory:It's not as lonely as it was, you know, as an entrepreneur.
Patricia Bathory:It is lonely, right?
Patricia Bathory:It's like there's these families that depend on you people you employ.
Patricia Bathory:My success, it's not just mine.
Patricia Bathory:So I can't fail.
Patricia Bathory:I feel like I can't fail because it's like all this responsibility.
Patricia Bathory:Whereas here in therapy, I facilitate.
Patricia Bathory:So it's almost like you get to go on a journey of self improvement, of self discovery, of, you know, how do we change or reframe these thoughts?
Patricia Bathory:And it's.
Patricia Bathory:I love this work, my, like, it's such a passion.
Patricia Bathory:I love it.
Patricia Bathory:I wonder.
Patricia Bathory:I wonder if it comes out my voice, but it truly is something I love doing well.
Kelly Kennedy:And I think that you are so unique.
Kelly Kennedy:You are so unique.
Kelly Kennedy:You know, you're keyed as the therapist for entrepreneurs.
Kelly Kennedy:And I think that that is really, really important because it takes an entrepreneur to know an entrepreneur, and you're not afraid to call out an entrepreneur on their shit because you are one and have made those same rationalizations in your own head.
Kelly Kennedy:So you can literally say you're kidding yourself, quit it.
Kelly Kennedy:Whereas I think there's a lot of therapists that wouldn't be willing to do that.
Kelly Kennedy:And frankly, there's not a lot of people willing to challenge an entrepreneur or a leader unless they are a leader themselves.
Patricia Bathory:Yeah, there's a little bit of that.
Patricia Bathory:I think.
Patricia Bathory:I think for therapy, the one predictor for successful therapy is the relationship between the client and the therapist.
Patricia Bathory:That's the number one predictor.
Patricia Bathory:It's not the approach you use, it's not where you were educated, it's not nothing.
Patricia Bathory:It's the relationship.
Patricia Bathory:And I find that for sure, the population of entrepreneurs resonates well with me.
Patricia Bathory:There's something about the way I speak.
Patricia Bathory:There's this assertiveness and this voice, and that's the way I present things that jives, that resonates, that they feel heard or seen.
Patricia Bathory:And for sure, I do.
Patricia Bathory:A lot of it is I see you because I see me in you.
Patricia Bathory:So it's a lot of the work I've done as well, a lot of the personality traits that I carry, so that even the ability to see them as great qualities, but also where the shortcomings come in.
Patricia Bathory:So for sure, that has something to do with it, but that doesn't mean that's exclusive to me.
Patricia Bathory:There's for sure other therapists that will do great work, even though they're not entrepreneurs.
Patricia Bathory:And they can also hold that space and make the client feel seen and heard and all that.
Patricia Bathory:But for sure, you have to know where you succeed.
Patricia Bathory:You know, clients that have the need for more supportive therapy, that need you to kind of be there.
Patricia Bathory:There's some questions and issues that I tend not to work well with and those I usually refer out because, again, I still have that.
Patricia Bathory:Like you, I like to win.
Patricia Bathory:I like to see clients that I know I'm going to be successful with and I'm going to have a good rate like that things will move forward.
Patricia Bathory: le interview first, you know,: Patricia Bathory:And then if I see it's gonna be a great match and we're gonna move forward and it's gonna happen, then sure, I'll start the work.
Patricia Bathory:Otherwise, I'm like, you know what, this I'm not very good with.
Patricia Bathory:And here's great people that I work with, and they do great work with you, and you'll be way better served by this therapist.
Patricia Bathory:And then I just refer them out.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:No, it is amazing, though, and I think it is a specialty.
Kelly Kennedy:I don't think I've ever seen somebody who specializes in entrepreneurship before.
Kelly Kennedy:And so I think this is really cool.
Kelly Kennedy:I'm really.
Kelly Kennedy:I'm really thankful we're having this conversation, and I'm pretty confident that somebody listening is gonna be like, I need to reach out to Patricia, because we're struggling with these same problems when I am.
Kelly Kennedy:When I started the business development podcast, one of my goals, my main goal was always to educate and inspire with every episode.
Kelly Kennedy:That's what we want to do.
Kelly Kennedy:My other goal was to be as open and vulnerable as possible, to show the real side of entrepreneurship, not the bullshit side that the world sees and all these people on this giant pedestal, but the fact that we're all people and we still suffer together.
Kelly Kennedy:Right.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, we still have the same problem.
Kelly Kennedy:It's very, very real.
Kelly Kennedy:And I've been as open and transparent as possible, frankly, more open and transparent than I've even been probably, in my personal life and for a lot of my life.
Kelly Kennedy:So, you know, I think.
Kelly Kennedy:I think having conversations like this where we can be open and vulnerable and nothing sugarcoat it, talk about the truth of the reality and become more human and show that, you know, everybody is capable of entrepreneurship.
Kelly Kennedy:Everybody has it in them if they want to take that.
Kelly Kennedy:That jump, because so many people have great ideas, are inspired, you know, could change the world, but they're just afraid to take that step.
Kelly Kennedy:And, you know, one of the questions that I wanted to ask you was, what was it that made you take your initial entrepreneurial jump?
Kelly Kennedy:Were you just born that way, or was there a catalyst that kind of spearheaded that for you?
Patricia Bathory:No.
Patricia Bathory:In.
Patricia Bathory:In respect for the truth, I don't agree with you that everybody can be an entrepreneur.
Kelly Kennedy:No.
Patricia Bathory:Hey, I know.
Patricia Bathory:It's not that I don't believe.
Patricia Bathory:I mean, that came out harsh, but I think an entrepreneur has a set of skills that it's not that nobody's.
Patricia Bathory:It's not that people are not capable of it.
Patricia Bathory:Some people just don't want it.
Patricia Bathory:And I think that is to be respected my own path.
Patricia Bathory:Like, I would have never chosen to be an entrepreneur.
Patricia Bathory:I'll tell you that for sure.
Patricia Bathory:So, when I finished my, like, I finished an MBA, and then I finished a master's.
Patricia Bathory:Master's in management, in France, all I wanted was to be an executive.
Patricia Bathory:All I want, like, get a big company, get a great multinational job, go up the ranks, make it to sea level and happy as we like.
Patricia Bathory:That was the plan I had for myself.
Patricia Bathory:Never, ever, ever.
Patricia Bathory:But then I went to Brazil.
Patricia Bathory:I went back.
Patricia Bathory:When I finished, I went back to Brazil, was dating my husband already.
Patricia Bathory:We were engaged at that time.
Patricia Bathory:And I'm like, okay, fine, I'm gonna go to Brazil.
Patricia Bathory:I have great education.
Patricia Bathory:It's gonna happen.
Patricia Bathory:I got no job offers for the amount of money I wanted to make.
Patricia Bathory:I got some job offers, and I wasn't.
Patricia Bathory:And let me explain that, that I was not looking for a bunch of money.
Patricia Bathory:It was just something reasonable, right?
Patricia Bathory:Somebody with an MBA, I'm like, I should be paid at least, like, enough to pay my bills.
Patricia Bathory:And nothing.
Patricia Bathory:I did not get any offers.
Patricia Bathory:The only offer I got was, like, to work in an old industry that I wasn't interested in.
Patricia Bathory:It still didn't pay very well.
Patricia Bathory:So I'm like, well, this is not for me.
Patricia Bathory:Now, my husband, he is the one to blame for all of this.
Patricia Bathory:He, like, for sure, like, pestered me and pestered me, and like, you got to open your own business.
Patricia Bathory:You got to do your own thing.
Patricia Bathory:You got to open your business.
Patricia Bathory:Oh, my God, for Christ's sakes.
Patricia Bathory:Like, no.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, you come from an entrepreneurial family.
Patricia Bathory:His dad's an entrepreneur.
Patricia Bathory:Everybody there, they have their own businesses.
Patricia Bathory:They run their own thing.
Patricia Bathory:And he's like, you got to do it.
Patricia Bathory:You got to do it.
Patricia Bathory:Then it's all yours.
Patricia Bathory:And I'm like, for Christ sakes, no, no, no.
Patricia Bathory:And sure enough, so then I opened my business, and my business was consulting for companies that wanted to export.
Patricia Bathory:So that's how it all started.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, I speak English.
Patricia Bathory:I can talk to the FDA.
Patricia Bathory:I can get your products approved.
Patricia Bathory:I can get everything kind of adjusted to make sure you get into the us.
Patricia Bathory:And sure enough.
Patricia Bathory:And then I'm like, whatever.
Patricia Bathory:Sales, I want a percentage.
Patricia Bathory:I want a commission on the sales.
Patricia Bathory:But it was my own business.
Patricia Bathory:So did that for a year.
Patricia Bathory:I was working, still fixed, was very little that the idea was that I was going to make money on the sales for a year, I made very little money.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, I'm quitting this.
Patricia Bathory:This is no good.
Patricia Bathory:Like, somebody with an MBA should be making more money.
Patricia Bathory:He's like, relax, relax.
Patricia Bathory:It's going to work out, right?
Patricia Bathory:The wisdom.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, oh, for Christ's sake.
Patricia Bathory:So again, so it's 100% his fault because he was so adamant and he was such a believer.
Patricia Bathory:For a year and a half, Kelly, I made no money.
Patricia Bathory:Like, I made like a month.
Patricia Bathory:It was hideous.
Patricia Bathory:And I'm like, I can have an allowance for my parents that is bigger than this stupid salary.
Kelly Kennedy:It was so dumb.
Patricia Bathory:Like, it was so I worked.
Patricia Bathory:Like, I've never worked so hard for such little money.
Patricia Bathory:But sure enough, I'm very grateful to him because it was 100% him.
Patricia Bathory:I would have for sure quit and found a job.
Patricia Bathory:It turns around, and when it does, then it's like, cha ching.
Patricia Bathory:It's all good.
Patricia Bathory:The money keeps coming in.
Patricia Bathory:It's recurring sale now.
Patricia Bathory:It's all good.
Patricia Bathory:But it took a while for things to take off.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah, I guess.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, did you, did you embrace it eventually?
Patricia Bathory:Yes.
Patricia Bathory:Yes, I did.
Patricia Bathory:Yes, I did.
Patricia Bathory:Not now, I could not imagine a better life, so now I would never go back.
Patricia Bathory:But sure, now it's like 30 years later.
Patricia Bathory:Not 30, but like 23 years.
Patricia Bathory:But I'd say the first five years, I oscillated a lot.
Patricia Bathory:I oscillated a lot because the first five years, that's when you're building your business.
Patricia Bathory:That's when you're working tons to not make a lot of money.
Patricia Bathory:Right?
Patricia Bathory:And also, if you think about this, I had two babies in those five years.
Kelly Kennedy:Oh, wow.
Patricia Bathory:Right?
Patricia Bathory:So I'm like, I remember I'm, like, nursing and kind of checking emails as I'm there.
Patricia Bathory:Like, it's like my mat leave was ten days.
Patricia Bathory:For ten days, I didn't check the computer.
Patricia Bathory:And then, because I'm working from home, but ten days, I didn't check the computer.
Patricia Bathory:And then you're still doing this.
Patricia Bathory:It's, it's hard.
Patricia Bathory:And I'm like, why am I doing this?
Patricia Bathory:I'm not even making, like, why am I doing this?
Patricia Bathory:Because I'm not making for sure.
Patricia Bathory:It's not for the money.
Patricia Bathory:Right?
Patricia Bathory:So five years into it, then things turn around, and it's like, okay, oh, hang on.
Patricia Bathory:Oh, this is good.
Patricia Bathory:But it took a while.
Patricia Bathory:So five years, it was rough.
Patricia Bathory:I could not brag about my work for five years.
Patricia Bathory:And then afterwards, okay, all right, then.
Patricia Bathory:So now, hindsight, I'm like, everybody should be an entrepreneur.
Patricia Bathory:But first five years, I'm like, this is dumb.
Kelly Kennedy:It is painful.
Kelly Kennedy:It has its moments.
Kelly Kennedy:I remember talking to my boss, you know, before I became an entrepreneur, and I worked with him for ten years, and he goes, Kelly, you know, you're an entrepreneur when you wake up at two in the morning and you're terrified about the future.
Kelly Kennedy:And I remember waking up at two in the morning being terrified about the future and be like, okay, I made it.
Patricia Bathory:I am an entrepreneur.
Patricia Bathory:For sure, for sure, for sure.
Patricia Bathory:And I'll tell you this.
Patricia Bathory:And I was from, like, I was in an extremely privileged position because in the first five years that I'm working lots and making very little, my husband's like, money is not a problem.
Patricia Bathory:Like, he's supporting the house.
Patricia Bathory:He's like, we don't worry about it.
Patricia Bathory:So I didn't have, like, the money thing was more me because I'm like, I want it to be financially independent.
Patricia Bathory:Like, I wanted to make lots of money.
Patricia Bathory:It was.
Patricia Bathory:It was a Patricia thing.
Patricia Bathory:But ultimately, our housing, all the bills were paid, and even still, it was a struggle.
Patricia Bathory:So if you add to that the response, the financial responsibility that 99% of entrepreneurs have that I didn't because I was privileged.
Patricia Bathory:Man, oh, man.
Patricia Bathory:I don't know how we all make it.
Patricia Bathory:Like, I do not know.
Patricia Bathory:How am I.
Patricia Bathory:Oh, man, we should have, like, this.
Patricia Bathory:Entrepreneurs Anonymous.
Patricia Bathory:I'm Patricia Adam, entrepreneur.
Patricia Bathory:Let's talk about PTSD.
Patricia Bathory:It's crazy.
Kelly Kennedy:It is crazy.
Kelly Kennedy:It is crazy.
Kelly Kennedy:It's this, like, crazy roller coaster that's kind of.
Kelly Kennedy:That's like, the best thing that I can even compare it to is that you're going to have amazing highs and terrifying lows, and hopefully every once in a while, you find yourself on the way out.
Patricia Bathory:And even today, like, and even today, right, like, again, 23 year old business, it's very established, it's very solid, very good set of clients, reoccurring sales every year.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, okay, what's going to happen this year?
Patricia Bathory:Like, am I going to be able to supply everything?
Patricia Bathory:Are the.
Patricia Bathory:Are the maritime companies going to be good?
Patricia Bathory:Are we going to have a Suez Canal problem?
Patricia Bathory:Panama canal now?
Patricia Bathory:Like, so Panama is all back up.
Patricia Bathory:Is it going to be Covid?
Patricia Bathory:Are the ports I sell to Baltimore?
Patricia Bathory:That bridge was no good for me.
Patricia Bathory:Like, the bridge that collapsed, okay?
Patricia Bathory:I use that bridge for all of my shippings.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, oh, Baltimore is my biggest port where I sell to.
Patricia Bathory:So that collapse, I'm like, all of a sudden, that whole week, I'm like, where are we diverting all these containers?
Patricia Bathory:I have a bunch of containers in this here.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, where are we diverting?
Patricia Bathory:It's nuts, right?
Patricia Bathory:So every day is.
Patricia Bathory:There's never a dull day in an entrepreneur's life.
Kelly Kennedy:No, but honestly, like, I couldn't imagine going back now, being the other side of it, it's like once you've gone this route on your own and proven that you can do it, the personal empowerment of entrepreneurship is worth it on its own.
Patricia Bathory:You can make it happen.
Patricia Bathory:You can make things happen.
Patricia Bathory:You drink the Kool Aid, you never go back.
Patricia Bathory:The empowerment, and I find, too, the empowerment for good.
Patricia Bathory:Because if I can sell food and if I can get through the FDA, if I can do this, man, why am I not using these talents to enhance and better humanity?
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:Like, it got me to this.
Patricia Bathory:I got to do something.
Patricia Bathory:If I'm able to.
Patricia Bathory:If I was able to get this done, hey, where can I contribute now to make other people thrive as well?
Patricia Bathory:And.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:So that, to me, it did a flip on the empowerment of, there are some talents that maybe I can put to use to service.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:To contribute.
Patricia Bathory:So that was my big.
Patricia Bathory:That was my pivotal moment.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:No, it's.
Kelly Kennedy:It's amazing.
Kelly Kennedy:I'm a huge advocate for entrepreneurship.
Kelly Kennedy:We're always trying to inspire a few to take a jump on the show, and I think we might have just done that.
Kelly Kennedy:I want to chat with you, Patricia, about some of the services that you offer, because obviously, you know, we've talked about therapy, but you offer.
Kelly Kennedy:You offer some other services as well.
Kelly Kennedy:Can we go through the full gamut of the services that you provide?
Patricia Bathory:Yes.
Patricia Bathory:So I.
Patricia Bathory:I do the.
Patricia Bathory:The.
Patricia Bathory:It's almost a pyramid I was talking about to my marketing.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, we should have this on a pyramid.
Patricia Bathory:So, the entry level is the book.
Patricia Bathory:So, yeah, the book is about connections, about bettering your relationships in your personal life and professional life.
Patricia Bathory:So, the book is the entry.
Patricia Bathory:I do have the sessions, the one on one.
Patricia Bathory:It's therapy, it's psychotherapy.
Patricia Bathory:It's one on one sessions.
Patricia Bathory:We can do it every week, do it every two weeks.
Patricia Bathory:People do it whichever way they want.
Patricia Bathory:I do, though, for companies, I speak and I do workshops, and mostly that's focused on company culture, how to create a connected culture so that companies can create these strong teams that then can succeed.
Patricia Bathory:And the strong teams are made when people can connect across differences, when people can connect across generations and across values and cultures.
Patricia Bathory:So that is what that big work is.
Patricia Bathory:And that is something I'm really focusing on these days, because, again, like I told you, it's not about what the leaders think.
Patricia Bathory:It's about how are you going to succeed as a leader in a changing workforce?
Patricia Bathory:Because people are not quitting.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:So now it's, do I cater for the leaders not really, because I am catering for their business.
Patricia Bathory:Who's my client?
Patricia Bathory:The business.
Patricia Bathory:Because if I cater for the boss, then I'm going to try to convert the workforce to what the boss believes.
Patricia Bathory:No, my client is the business.
Patricia Bathory:For the business to succeed, I need these two, the leader and the workforce, to communicate and connect.
Patricia Bathory:And that's what the workshops are about and some of these keynotes.
Kelly Kennedy:Well, now you have me really curious.
Kelly Kennedy:When you're working with these organizations, what are some of the common issues that you're finding?
Patricia Bathory:We talked about one of them here, which is where, again, think of who the C suites are.
Patricia Bathory:They're people my age.
Patricia Bathory:So you have these like late forties, early fifties, they're on your C suites.
Patricia Bathory:They are directors, they're managing partners.
Patricia Bathory:And the workforce that comes under them, they're young and they don't stay in their jobs.
Patricia Bathory:They.
Patricia Bathory:The turnaround is really hard, is really high.
Patricia Bathory:The disengagement is huge.
Patricia Bathory:They're just not connected.
Patricia Bathory:They're like, whatever, man, I'll come to work.
Patricia Bathory:But I'm quitting at two.
Patricia Bathory:And the owner's like, you can't quit at two.
Patricia Bathory:If this needs to be done, I need you to be engaged.
Patricia Bathory:I need you to be, you know, to really believe in this and get this done.
Patricia Bathory:I need you to be totally in, on board on this.
Patricia Bathory:And they're nothing.
Patricia Bathory:And a lot of the times, the problem is the leaders and the C suites don't understand how we motivate the workforce.
Patricia Bathory:So the work that I do with leaders in workshops, so workshops is smaller, is about how can you connect across these differences and across these generations.
Patricia Bathory:So that's one of the things that I do and the other thing that I do is talk to the workforce.
Patricia Bathory:So I get brought in to speak to the workforce and get the workforce to understand that, yes, we need to be connected to a purpose, yes, we need to be connected to values.
Patricia Bathory:And I'm only going to work for this boss if I respect them, if their values are aligned with mine.
Patricia Bathory:Correct.
Patricia Bathory:But I need you to be accountable, right?
Patricia Bathory:Because a lot of times they're just not accountable.
Patricia Bathory:It's like, oh, I want a mental health day.
Patricia Bathory:You know what, that's great.
Patricia Bathory:You take your mental health day, but the stuff you need to hand in needs to be handed in.
Patricia Bathory:So it's, it's, it's pushing both sides so that we can be in a workplace where we're all accountable.
Patricia Bathory:Things get done.
Patricia Bathory:We're still pushing forward, we're still moving forward, but it's a human workforce where, yes, sometimes you will need a mental health day.
Patricia Bathory:And if I'm not in my computer today from twelve to two, you're not going to get on my case because all my stuff got done.
Patricia Bathory:Maybe I worked from twelve to two midnight.
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:So where there's a little bit of that autonomy, it's, it's, it's give and push.
Patricia Bathory:Because right now we're polarized because the, the bosses, again, they're like digging their heels and it has to be this way.
Patricia Bathory:And the workforce is going, no, it has to be this way.
Patricia Bathory:We want all these rights, but we're also not delivering.
Patricia Bathory:It is about really getting people together because things were changing.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:Like, I actually agree with you completely.
Kelly Kennedy:If you get the work done, I don't care, I don't care.
Kelly Kennedy:I want it done as long as I get the results.
Kelly Kennedy:How you got there, it's like, it's like you don't have to show me the math, just give me the right answer.
Kelly Kennedy:Right.
Kelly Kennedy:But like you said, the other side is, what do you do when they're not showing you the math and you're still not getting the result?
Kelly Kennedy:I think that's the struggle where we're all finding ourselves as leaders right now, where it's like, okay, we feel like we've given the leeway, but we're still not getting the result.
Kelly Kennedy:And we're not really sure how to motivate them to want to achieve more.
Kelly Kennedy:And I think that's hard.
Patricia Bathory:And that is a huge, huge, huge question.
Patricia Bathory:And in this, in these talks to the workforce, it has to do with take your position away for a bit and let's get on the shoes of whoever's running this business.
Patricia Bathory:How would you run it?
Patricia Bathory:Right.
Patricia Bathory:And then get them to walk a mile in these shoes so that it's not about them, because a lot of it is that entitlement.
Patricia Bathory:It's about me, I need this, that, and you're like, okay, but how does the business move forward if it's all about you?
Patricia Bathory:Right, so the work has to be done on both ends.
Patricia Bathory:Absolutely.
Patricia Bathory:The workforce needs to be educated if they want to be successful because I think too, they come in at 25, in their twenties and early thirties, and a lot of it is not even realizing that you actually do need to work hard.
Patricia Bathory:You might get the mental health days and we will value all this.
Patricia Bathory:And you can work a four day week.
Patricia Bathory:Absolutely.
Patricia Bathory:If you produce really well, if you deliver really well, and if you're willing to.
Patricia Bathory:You know what?
Patricia Bathory:I'm going to take Friday off, but I'm going to start my Monday on Sunday evening just to get stuff together.
Patricia Bathory:So that Monday, like I'm on and I'm 100% on and everything's done.
Patricia Bathory:So they need that education too, which when somebody from the outside comes in and tells them that it's much better received than if the boss.
Kelly Kennedy:Oh yeah.
Kelly Kennedy:So that's, I believe that it's like the therapist.
Patricia Bathory:Like I'm telling stuff.
Patricia Bathory:It's like my wife told me this.
Patricia Bathory:I'm like, listen to your wife.
Kelly Kennedy:Yeah, it, I totally, totally believe you.
Kelly Kennedy:This sounds super, super important.
Kelly Kennedy:I know there's people listening.
Kelly Kennedy:They're like, we need this.
Kelly Kennedy:How do they get ahold of you?
Patricia Bathory:Patricia LinkedIn right now is the best way.
Patricia Bathory:I do have a website.
Patricia Bathory:It's patriciabathry.com, but it's, but it's under construction.
Patricia Bathory:So it is under construction.
Patricia Bathory:I'm getting things organized with the speaking, putting a speaking reel in, just putting all the context.
Patricia Bathory:Nice.
Patricia Bathory:But patriciabathory.com, you can try it.
Patricia Bathory:Maybe it'll be up, maybe it won't.
Patricia Bathory:Otherwise, LinkedIn, Patricia Bathory can text me there, message me there, drop me a note, we can get talking.
Patricia Bathory:It'll be a pleasure.
Patricia Bathory:Hopefully I can help businesses move forward, especially canadian albertan businesses.
Patricia Bathory:It'll be great.
Patricia Bathory:It'll be a pleasure.
Kelly Kennedy:Oh, okay.
Kelly Kennedy:Let's get, let's get a little more specific, though.
Kelly Kennedy:You could offer your services either across Canada or probably across North America.
Kelly Kennedy:Correct.
Patricia Bathory:I can offer my services anywhere because it is online now with, I actually, I was in Istanbul last week giving a talk to Istanbul.
Patricia Bathory:So it's, you can move around and you can do whatever.
Patricia Bathory:Get on the plane and you get that done.
Patricia Bathory:So anywhere therapy services, if it's psychotherapy and if you need to claim it on your insurance, then that's across Canada.
Patricia Bathory:But I do have clients in the states and other places that, it's consulting work from a psychotherapist.
Patricia Bathory:So interpret that as we will.
Kelly Kennedy:Either way, if you pay for it, it's available.
Patricia Bathory:I'm not allowed to say I do psychotherapy in clients from the US.
Patricia Bathory:It's like, all right, consulting work.
Kelly Kennedy:Amazing.
Kelly Kennedy:Well, this has been really great.
Kelly Kennedy:We could have talked for like another 2 hours for sure.
Patricia Bathory:This was a great conversation.
Kelly Kennedy:So much to talk about.
Kelly Kennedy:I look forward to having you back again in the future, Patricia.
Kelly Kennedy:Until next time, this has been episode 174 of the Business Development podcast, and we will catch you on the flip side.
Mark Cuban:This has been the business development podcast with Kelly Kennedy.
Mark Cuban: business development firm in: Mark Cuban:His passion and his specialization is in customer relationship generation and business development.
Mark Cuban:The show is brought to you by capital business development, your business development specialists.
Mark Cuban:For more we invite you to the website at www.
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Mark Cuban:See you next time on the Business Development podcast.
